Human 21: John Eales AM

Former Wallaby Captain

John Eales is the most successful Wallaby captain ever, and was one of the first players ever to win multiple Rugby World Cups. As a result, it’s impossible to succinctly summarise all of his achievements. Here are a few: John was made a Member of the Order of Australia for services to the community and rugby in 1999, was inducted into the Australian Institute of Sports ‘best of the best’ in 2001, the Sport Australia Hall of Fame in 2003 (where he was later awarded legend status), the International Rugby Hall of Fame in 2007, and the Wallaby Hall of Fame in 2011. Over his playing career with the Queensland Reds and Wallabies, John earned the nickname, “Nobody”… because “Nobody’s perfect”.

Currently, John is the Chair of ASX listed Trajan Group Holdings, sits on the board of Magellan Financial Group and Flight Centre Travel Group, and is also an investor and director in a number of private unlisted businesses. 

John is a human mammal. Here are his thoughts:

What brings you the most joy in life?

In a word, family, and I mean extended family. I was fortunate to be one of six children and Lara is one of four, so there’s always a reason for us to get everyone together and celebrate. 

What does success mean to you?

Success is about achieving meaningful shared and personal goals. It’s not only about sailing through simple times, but successfully navigating the more difficult times in life. Success is also about enjoying the success of others, not only when, but especially when you have helped them along their journey. 

What do you see as your greatest achievement?

To have built some great friendships with people who I know I can trust with anything. 

What are you most grateful for?

Two things; one, the freedoms that we have in Australia, although I fear that some of these are starting to be challenged; and, two, the communities of my life. The rugby community is a wonderful example. It started for me as an eight-year-old at Ashgrove Juniors and it just keeps getting bigger and broader. 

Who or what has had the biggest influence on your life? 

I won the lottery with my parents, Jack and Rosa, and then just got luckier with my family and friends from there. The shared experiences of that large collective have had the greatest influence on my life.

What do you regret?

I try not to regret as much as learn.

Has there been a defining moment in your life? Can you tell us about it?

When I was 18, my sister, Carmel, died of cancer. She was 20 years of age and had so much life to live. Her death hit our family in a profound way and had an enormous influence on my life. I always looked at the fact that she had so much life to live, but it was all taken from her at such an early age. Through the next couple of decades of my life, whenever I felt down or unmotivated, I would think of Carmel and the opportunities she didn’t have. It charged me with a sense of responsibility to not waste any of the opportunities I had in my life.

What advice would you give your younger self?

I would encourage my younger self to be braver. As you get older you begin to realise that there are a lot of things you shouldn’t worry about, and one of those is failure. 

What is the most important thing we can teach kids in school? 

My father, Jack, who passed away 16 years ago, was a teacher, a school principal, and an incredibly decent man. I understood from him that an education should teach you how to think rather than what to think. When I review what I most gained from my education it was rarely about the content and most often about the learnings of the process. Maths, English, history, or science, each teach you to think in different ways, and each of those methods of thinking can be applied usefully to other disciplines. A well-rounded education, teaching you how to approach problems from different perspectives, is so beneficial for success in life. 

If you could have a conversation with anyone, living or dead, who would you choose and why?

I have always admired great communicators, especially those who use their skill for good, which many don’t. Many of the best communicators have been some of the greatest musicians, such as Bob Dylan and Paul Simon. I would love to sit down with Paul Simon and understand more about the creative process of writing songs. I can’t play music and I can’t sing, but I have deep respect for those who can, and those who compose the music and can write such succinct and meaningful lyrics. 

When did you last have a significant change of mind?

I think it’s very important to be curious in life, and if you are curious, you have to be flexible in your thinking. So, most people who are curious will often change their mind when they are in the process of learning more about a subject or even a person. 

What is the role of luck in our lives?

The first lottery I won was choosing my parents well! Luck will always play its part in our lives. In rugby, luck is represented by the unpredictable bounce of the oblong ball. Our goal in life has to be to leave no stone unturned such that we minimise the role that luck plays. The harder and the smarter you work preparing for anything, the less a role luck will play. 

Do you have a favourite quote? What is it? Why do you like it?

An Irish cab driver told me in 1992 to ‘love what you do, not what you did’. I’ve never forgotten it as, to me, it signifies that you have to live your life in the present, for the future, and not live your life looking to your past. 

What would you do with your life if you had unlimited financial resources?

My core life wouldn’t change as I love the broad matter of tasks I spend my time on. In saying that, however, I would travel more internationally and focus more on enhancing some of the work I do with charity. I think I would also take time to study something, anything, at one of the great universities in the world, purely out of interest.   

If you could have the definitive answer to a single question, what would you ask?

When do we get back to normal from Corona virus! 

What concept/fact/idea should every human on the planet understand?

The world would be a much kinder place if we all had greater tolerance of, and respect for, each other’s differences.

Do human beings have free will?

I believe we (mostly) have free will, but we must understand that freedom of will and freedom of speech doesn’t equate to freedom from consequences. 

Do you believe in God?

Yes, but I believe that God presents to different people in different ways and forms, none of which are wrong. For some, God may present as a flower, others as Buddha and others as Jesus. It doesn’t matter for mine how God presents, and, as long as no harm is intended, we should respect everyone’s views. 

Will the continual development of technology have a net positive or negative influence on humanity?

Technological advancement is not a problem in itself, in fact, it’s crucial, but often the application of advancement can be challenging. I am incredibly concerned about the effects of social media and the pressures it puts on people, especially young people who are in the formative stages of developing their view of themselves and of the world. I think the echo-chambers many people set up for themselves reinforce opinions rather than challenge them, leading to greater division, and that’s a problem. 

What is the single greatest achievement of humanity?

The production of a vaccine for Covid has to be up there with a long list of great achievements. 

What do you see as the biggest existential threat to humanity?

The broadening gap between the haves and the have-nots in society. 

What does it mean to live a good life?

To live a good life is to live a life where you are kind to others and kind to yourself. Kindness is not mutually exclusive to other important concepts such as competition and ambition, however, it strongly incorporates the philosophy of respect for others. 

What is a good death?

Where you are able to reflect and be proud of a life where you have lived, loved, learned and been successful in achieving your own goals, while also advancing opportunities for others to have done the same. 

Thanks for your time, John!

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